> I said, I thought that if the only goal you had in your life was to obey God then that was kind of shallow.

And if I do nothing but obey my God throughout the whole rest of my life, ignoring what I want, doing what He said not because I wanted to do that anyway but because *He* told me to, obeying Him out of love for Him and trust in Him and His wisdom... well, I certainly hope I will be able to do that.

Using your example of charity, some people give not because God told them "Give" but because God told them "Love others as I have loved you," and they have come to have that love for others, and that is how they can express that love.

... but people who do not believe in God give to others out of love for them, too. I guess the difference there is whether that love for others comes from wholly loving God or not. And whichever of the two would be called shallow... I can see how you might call that shallow. But I know which I've chosen, and I believe it to be true.

> I don't want to attack religions, and I had sort of meant to avoid it fromt the start. I'm not sure what I'll attempt in the future, but I'm beginning to think it is not possible to talk about life without someone's religion being insulted

I'm not insulted. I don't think Sam is, either. Nor are we attacking or insulting your beliefs. I just wanted to try to make clearer in your eyes something about my beliefs.

Ria