> > > > Having established that good and evil
> are both needed...
> > >
> > > One quibble. "Unhappiness" and "evil"
> aren't even close to comparable concepts.
> >
> > But then again, I was arguing that some
> amount of unhappiness was a good thing -
> and hence it cannot be evil.
>
> Unhappiness is not evil, it is the result of evil.
> If there were no evil (sin) in the world, would
> there be unhappiness?
>
> I'm trying to think about this in terms of how
> the world should be, ideally, rather than how
> the world actually is. If mankind had never
> fallen; if evil and sin had never entered into the
> equation, would there be unhappiness? I don't
> think there would be.
>
> If unhappiness is a direct result of evil, can it
> truly be said that unhappiness is good? Good
> for us, yes, in the world as it exists today, but
> intrinsically good? I don't think so.
>
> Gri"overthinking this"shny

I agree with you that there wouldn't be unhappiness if there weren't evil, but evil isn't the direct cause of the kind of unhappiness we're talking about. That's good's reaction to evil. If Don were one of "them", that incident wouldn't have bothered him nearly as much, would it? There'd only be the unhappiness of losing the cost of a notebook, which would pragmatically be outweighed by the imperative to attract more customers and more commerce. There'd only be... well... *dissatisfaction* -- "Why can't I have more stuff?" -- not true righteous indignation, not the deep pain of knowing that the world is screwed up.

Because there is still good in the world, though, we have conflict between good and evil. That conflict produces, I'd say, most of the real, deep unhappiness in the world. The price is that they won't feel truly happy either. Comfort is a poor shadow of joy.

So I would say those who support the idea of good should definitely support the idea of unhappiness. Those responsible for much of the world's evil, in fact, are the biggest banner-wavers for a cheap and false happiness. "Why do you have to make a scene? It's just a notebook. Just let it go and be happy." "I need the money. So what if it isn't mine?" "The drugs make me feel good, they're the easiest way for me to feel good, and that's all I need to know." "It'd feel so good to waste him. Who cares about the law?" "We depend on the system for our country's prosperity. The slaves are a necessary part of that."

We won't be 100% happy until there is no evil in the world anymore. Till then it's a choice between living with true joy mixed with gnawing pain or a kind of numb blind comfort; "us" and "them". Though we all have some of both in us; sometimes even the best compromise and even the worst care, something I've found worthwhile to remember about others and myself, not that that makes incidents like the notebook any more fun to live through...

Ar"popping in to pop some pop philosophy"thur