> And yet, I still believe in God. Why? It's something that I can't put a finger on. The term for it is apriori knowledge -- something that proceeds any sort of logical reasoning. I just finished a Phil 101 class where we read a very interesting excerpt of a book written by a guy named Halverson (sorry, I forget his first name and the book. Still have it around here somewhere, if anyone's really interested I can find it). Neat guy, he used the human sense of awe about the universe as proof that God was real. We have this sort of ingrained incredible wonder about the physical space that we live in, he reasoned that there was no way it was all some sort of cosmic accident.
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I have not read his argument, but I used to argue similarly (to myself) that the very reason I should believe is because of this "feeling" I have that there is something more. That awe, that wonder -- yes! So powerful despite it's mystery, how could it NOT be true? But then I counter that with an idea based on us being a soulless bunch of chemicals and stimulants. Everything is based on pain or no pain or pleasure. Pain is bad. Pleasure is good. Seeing other die in pain makes me fear death as something that will be unpleasant, and not existing a state in which I will no longer feel pleasure. I don't want to feel pain and die. I like feeling pleasure, as I live. Therefore I have a feeling that something illogical (albeit wonderful) exists after my earth-life that is potentially wonderful. This thing is a mechanism to fool myself into feeling good.

I have had this argument many, many times. As of yet I am on neither side, but struggling at each end. Compromise, I discovered long ago, is impossible.

> I realize this is by no means a logically sound argument. But that's the point. It's a completely subjective idea. You can't prove God exists. It requires a leap of faith that proves to be a stumbling block for a lot of people. I believe this is what Tyler had trouble with.
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Yes. I am of the "see to believe" sort. Though my imagination allows me to speculate on many things, I do not necessarily believe most of them.

> I have an interesting thought here. For the longest time, I have felt like I just can't comprehend reality. I ask everyone who reads this to just sit and think about the nature of the universe. Just try and ponder a beginning to reality. Or, if you view it differently, a reality that simply always existed, but just in a different form. Try something a bit simpler: imagine death. Just try and comprehend your total non-existence. Everyone else on this planet can probably imagine a world without you in it, it should be easy for you to. And I don't mean an "It's a Wonderful Life" type of deal where you were never born, I mean imagine if suddenly you were no longer part of reality.
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I have done that. Just yesterday I was riding the van back from work -- a 1˝hr commute -- and (probably a result of something on the radio being recognized by my sub-concious)I pictured us crashing into a large truck, I felt my heart leap, and half an instant later flames thrust out at me and my view of the world went black. Then there was nothing. The End. This vision came out of nowhere and the whole scene was executed in mere seconds. As I was still alive and thinking, it wasn't accurate to the tee, I'm sure, but just the motion of blocking thoughts, sight, and sound for even a second was powerful.

I remember discussing in my senior English class some mechanism that makes it so a person is not aware that their heart is beating and that they are breathing (or perhaps we were just speculating on such a thing...). The subject cannot hear or feel themselves making the basic necessary motions of giving themselves air, and it generally leads to panic and feeling of total non-reality. As terrible as I know it would be....I'd love to try. Curiosity can be a beautiful demon.

> I don't know about the rest of you, but I can't get my mind around any of those.
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Not all the way. If we could, we wouldn't survive it.

>When I really try and think about them, it gives me a clue as to how clueless I am. Thus, not accepting something just because I don't fully understand it becomes quite easy.
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I tend to struggle with them fruitlessly.

Regards,
Tyler