> > > > So I pose the question back to you: is it possible to be "truly loving" without God? What's the *point*? Why even bother, when the alternative is to know the One who does know love like that?
> > > >
> > > > And that's my point.
> > >
> > > Basicly what I'm tring to say is that Human Nature is were God truly comes from. More impressive to me than any idea of an omnipotiant being who can do anything he wants to is that humans, a fragil conflicted and often confussed species has visited the moon, sent satalites out of our solar system, and we're still going. We keep reaching, we thrive under pressure. Did you ever see the Truman Show? I think humanity is getting to the point were we are standing at the door, ready to set out on our own, and we have to decide if we want to stay with our over protective father or be free. The religious refrences in that movie are many (the guy who is incharge of the show is called The Creator, he 'cues the sun', and he talks to Truman out of the sky. In any family one day the children leave the nest, if God is our father onr day we will have to strike out on our own.
> >
> > Please. God *created* the moon, not to mention the rest of the universe. Reaching the moon hardly seems a great feat compared to what He did.
>
> Yeah, but God can do anything so that is about as impressive as me drawing the moon. But we, with all our flaws and fears did something seemingly impossbile, and we've been doing impossbile things through out history (broke the sound barrier for instants)

And it's a testament to His creation that we have the ingenuity. But we placed those barriers upon ourselves. We made them seem impossible.

> > The director wasn't exactly benevolent. He intentionally damaged Truman's phyche, forcing phobias to take over much of his life.
> He killed the guy's father to keep him from getting away, for Pete's sake. Maybe Truman's journey to the outside world is something we can acheive only by death, but I don't pretend to know. We know [well, some of us] that there's something beyond this world. It's been no secret to us. We don't generally try to hasten our passage, rather we try to prepare for it and let God decide when it's time.
> >
> Ever read the book of Revelations, thats God's plan for the end of the world. I don't like it. I also belive Eve was the first hero in history, if not for here we would be nothing more than animals. The knowledge of Good and Evil gave humanity the freedom of choice. Thou mayest conquor over evil. We have the right to be damned, or saved, as we choose. You have to wonder why God didn't want us to have that.

Yah hah! That's possibly my pastor's favorite topic. I don't know if he's right or not, but according to Chuck, Revelation's written in Apocalyptic, a writing style with very specific interperetations. There won't really be seven-headed serpents and such and the whole thing should be translated into something along the lines of 'down with Nero.' I forget exactly. It's just another interpertation on the subject.

> > >Spider-ok, I kinda changed the topic but thats what I wanted to say-Boy
> >
> > I think I just changed it again... not sure.
> >
> > Chr"no stranger to theological debates... or any debate where I didn't know what I was talkling about"is
>
> Arn't they the best, If I had more class like this in college I'd be getting better grades.

Heh. I would have gotten better grades if I didn't spend every English class last year debating with my Buddhist friend or, in many cases, the entire class. I'm still deciding what I believe, but nothing strengthens my forming ideas more than the need to defend them. I'm forced to take a position and hold it until otherwise persuaded.

'Course, then we broke into groups-- symbolism, religious symbolism, and a few others-- to discuss The Truman Show. Then the practice payed off. And Fridays when we debated. But I digress.

> Spider-IncaseIdon'tseeya,goodafternoon,
> goodevening,andgoodnight-Boy

Chr"The world revolves around me, too"is